008 | Trusting The Process w/ Jamie Lou

hello good people and welcome back to another  episode of life is sound we're fully rolling   on the podcast now we're coming to the end  of season one and today I've got another   amazing guest Jamie Lou we have connected  over the years and kept in contact and   we drop each of the messages on social media  things we're sharing things that resonate with   each of us and she's a person in life that I have  thanked for things that she would share on social   media because I feel like we live in a day and  age where social media can be dangerous and it   can have negative impacts on us but I feel the  people that really choose to be vulnerable and   share certain things can really have a ripple  effect out to other people so that's why I   wanted to get Jamie on the podcast and have an  in-depth conversation I know it's going to be a   great one from brief convo that we've had before  this so Jamie if you want to introduce yourself   who you are what you do and then we'll get into  it hello hello and thank you for that introduction   um my name is Jamie Lou and I'm a yoga teacher and  nutritionist and spiritual being having a human   experience I guess um yeah I'm just grateful to be  here and I'm excited to chat so thank you I always   appreciate you coming and dedicating your time  because you know that's all we have in it time's   the most valuable thing that's what I keep really  appreciating to people you know if you come in   here and having a conversation and giving up your  time to be here I'm just super grateful and when   I like look at you and see you on social media  we only have a perception of what people choose   to share so I can only know you from a certain  space yeah but what I see is somebody that's like   constantly in a process of something so what  came up for me about what we would talk about   would be exactly that is trust in the process  because I've seen you since I've known you and   you're somebody who seems to like just do things  and you know things that would be scary to a lot   of people and it's just like you jump in but also  you choose to share those Journeys with people and   I feel like that's a very like vulnerable thing  to do and it can also Ripple out to other people   and impact their lives so what made you become  that type of person that just you know would jump   into things obviously I know you've been you are a  yoga teacher and you know you've studied nutrition   what got you on that journey of like trusting the  process jumping into things and choosing to share   that with people that's a good question um I guess  I could say I've always been like faithful I've   always had faith in something like from a really  young age I was raised like in a Catholic way by   my grandparents so I wasn't really but I didn't  believe in everything that I was listening to at   church but I always had a faith in something  that stuck with me but then throughout my   teen years like I had a little bit of a struggled  upbringing like I grew up around addiction and my   family Dynamics were really toxic so I say I  went through my teen years really not trusting   the process at all and just trying to control  everything trying to survive I remember thinking   when I was younger that life was a game and I had  to survive I had to use what I could in order to   get my needs met and you know I've reflected on  that it wasn't like I was thinking that at the   time but I remember thinking this is a game I need  to survive here you know so I didn't trust the   process for a long time until it got to a point  where I was like at my lowest point in my life   which was when I was 18 going on 19. um yeah it  was just a really hard time I ended up in hospital   and it was like a really sad time for me but it  was in that moment when everything was taken away   like I couldn't control anything and that I had no  choice but to trust the process it was like I've   got nothing else that I can do here all of these  things that I thought I could control before uh   completely out of my hands now and all I can do  is trust and so that moment that was the worst   moment of my life turned out to be in reflection  like the beginning of my life and a moment that I   can look back on now and actually say thank you  for I mean it you know and it took me a while   to get there and even to be able to speak about  it freely now with no shame no sadness no tears   well enough it's like oh wow this was something  that I really had to go through to to become   somebody who can't trust the process and  can know that things are never going to be   as bad as what we think they're going to be like  they're never going to be as bad as what we think   we're going to be they're always going to be all  right and so it just liberated me and gave me this   freedom to to take risks and to explore and to  just want to learn about life and people and be   curious I guess so yeah we get so locked in like  certain ways of doing things and some people when   they see people taking risks they'll try  and talk them out of it or tell them all   that's not the right thing for you or don't do  that because of this consequence and when you   find yourself in that position where nothing  makes sense in life when you come out of that   you do want to explore new things and you know  it's like you've got nothing to lose yeah in doing   that and if you can then take that and amplify  that out to other people and get people on a   similar Journey sometimes people do have to go  to that extreme like you know that true suffering   to know what that's like to be able to push  other people in a positive direction some   people can just hear it from you know the likes  of someone like yourself and then jump on board   and start to move in in the wrong way but it's  a common thing that a lot of people um you know   self-aware or working on themselves or you know  tapping into things like yoga meditation and these   things that really do help our mindset and help  us grow as humans and it's a never-ending Journey   a lot of the time people have been in a really  dark place not everyone but people have to go to   that place to understand like how difficult  things can be and how empty life can feel   so like what we were talking about yesterday  before this podcast you do start appreciating   Small Things oh yeah and it's it's like for  me when I wake up I just say thank you yeah   I've woke up today when I'm before I go to sleep  I'm like thank you I thank you for the daylight   appreciate it because tomorrow's not guaranteed  and we all live our lives like we're going to be   here forever exactly and we're here for a very  short time and I think like having people close   to me getting sick this year is just really  re-highlighted that to me in my life that   you know we're here for a short time so whilst I'm  here let's try and do some good in the world and   connect with people like yourself and other people  that we you know mutually know and even strangers   to just start trying to level everyone  up and and move forward and that's me   trusting this process as well like it's it's  scary being vulnerable especially like when   you're putting it out on the internet to  people we're just having a conversation in   a room now me and you there's technically no  one watching but when I put it out there is   eyes on it yeah and it is a very strange thing  and it is trusting the process completely and   what would you say trust in the process looks  like to you if you had something come up and   you were like whoa this is a huge decision or  something huge that is facing me whether it's   positive or negative because sometimes you can be  scared of the positive things the positive changes   that are a bit overwhelming what would you say  trust in the process looks like to you [Music]   I mean before I've always had this This  and like got quite an adventurous spirit   so I kind of perceive life as an adventure a  lot of the time so it's a lot harder for me   to trust the process when I'm going through  a hard time obviously when I'm in a flow and   like everything's happening amazingly like of  course it's easy to just say trust the process   but when things are really challenging and you  know when Things Are getting heavy and people just   can say oh trust the process trust the process  that doesn't land in the same way does it when   it is like yeah okay I'm trusting the process but  why and all of these other questions come up it's   one of the worst things to hear someone say if  you're going through it and someone says it's   you and you're like come on man I don't want you  to say that right now I'm really going through it   yeah it can be really triggering actually if you  say to somebody trust the process everything's   going to be fine when they're going through like  the worst time of their life is yeah like no I and   yeah trusting the process doesn't always have to  be like a positive thing it's not that trust the   process everything's fine it's like trust  the process any negative emotion that I'm   going through any sadness that I'm experiencing is  just as valid as any positive experience we have   this idea in society that we always have to be  happy and everything should be positive and have   a positive mental attitude and I've realized in  my journey like of course we should focus on the   positive and the perspective should be positive  but if that means bypassing everything that's   actually going on for you and not admitting like  I'm in a [ __ ] place I'm feeling sad like I also   need to validate that part of my experience you  can trust that and you can trust that everything   changes and you can know that it's never going  to stay bad it's never going to stay you know   negative it's going to change at some point so  I guess just from experience really of noticing   that everything [ __ ] that's ever happened to  me over some kind of years or some period of time   it's turned out to be one of the best things  that's happened to me because of the lessons   the humility the vulnerability that comes from  that like the ego deaths and like pulling back   the layers yeah so I think that like challenges  are the greatest gift in some sense and if we   can look at it in that way and see that it's  just building our spirit building our strength   then it helps it helps a lot because you can sort  of zoom out and look at every struggle that you're   going through and just hold on and know that it's  going to pass so I do believe that there is like   some kind of lesson in everything that that we  go through and so I have a trust in that whether   something and whether any decision that I'm  going to make ends up working out or not there's   a lesson in there for me and there's something  that I can take from it whether it goes the way   that I want it to or not yeah so I kind of stick  with that and run with that it's a it's a scary   thing isn't it because when it comes to like  decisions and paths there's always two options   my dad's always said this to me like you've always  got two paths when you're presented with a choice   and you can only ever know one of them and what  we what we do as humans is we walk one of them   but we go oh I wonder what that one would have  been like oh yeah yeah I think I've taken the   wrong part and it's so true that these whatever  path you walk is the thing that gets you to the   right destination it might not have been the route  you thought you would have took but you're always   in the right place and I can't like communicate  that to the listeners enough especially when   you're going through the darkest of times that's  when you feel like oh well what if I wouldn't have   done this or what if I would have made that choice  there would this have been different yeah you're   always going to have to go through that thing  however you get there yeah the tough times are   always always going to come and I think one thing  I've noticed with with you on social media is we   all share the highlights of Our Lives don't we  hey look at me doing this look at me doing that   on holiday look at my new car check my new watch  all the things that we're all programmed to do on   this these platforms one thing I've observed with  you is you rarely have shared like the vulnerable   side of you you know when it's not going well  and you're going through it and you know you've   been vulnerable enough to to show yourself you  know crying and I'm really going through it and   I think people can we'll watch something like  that and resonate with it but as we said before   we spoke about his podcast there will be people  that look at that and go oh she's after attention   and these things when you choose vulnerability  and to share it it brings up so much in in us   as humans and I can like observe it and think how  people might be reacting to this then that's just   the way I break things down I watch something like  amazing that's beautiful now how might somebody   else yeah yeah yeah react to this but I feel  like that's one thing you've done and I rarely   see people doing that on social media is saying  hey here's me when things aren't going right and   things are a bit [ __ ] it takes a lot to be like  I could never imagine like posting myself crying   on social media like saying you know it's not  going well but in that you actually help a lot of   people what what chose you to make those decisions  to open that up to other people well first of all   like I I have those same um like fears and worries  like oh certain people are gonna judge me wrong or   judge me and think that I'm craving attention  and blah blah that all goes through my head as   well it's not like I'm just throwing it out there  without without anything exactly yeah I'm just   obviously I have those fears but I've done a lot  of work on myself in that respect and I know that   anything that's like trapped inside of me that  I'm allowing to come out that I'm allowing to   to come out like energy moving emotion moving  through me is he it's healing me there's no shame   in that there's no shame in me being vulnerable  and if I can everybody's vulnerable I'm not the   only person in the world that experiences that you  know and I know that because I'm human and so are   you like we all experience vulnerability  I'm just brave enough I guess I'll have   worked through some fears in a way that I'm not  going to let the opinion of somebody that doesn't   even know me affects my expression yeah and it's  like gives me a lot of power to be able to do   that you know to there's a huge part of me that  wants to express itself all the time and no not   just when things are good when things are also not  good because I'm human and it's the I'm the full   spectrum of all of these things and so um yeah  it's a lot of work it's not it's not easy it's   like constantly reminding yourself like why are  you why you want to put something out there it's   like I want to show that you know I'm human and  I feel a lot and it's okay for you to to do the   same yeah I feel like everything that I put out  be that like judge worthy or if that's even the   word I get it it gives people permission to do the  same some people will judge me but people judge   everyone anyway so true you know like if I said  something else then people will have an opinion   like I don't expect to not be judged and nor do  I expect to be liked by everyone at like it's   just life there's always someone looking at what  you choose to put out or I can relate a lot put   like a lot of great stuff about music and again  it's a vulnerable thing when you put out like a   creation or something you spend hours and hours  tapping into and then you go like what here you go   how are people going to react to it and what I've  realized is no matter what you share whether it's   you know your journey of yoga you crying about how  you're currently feeling new piece of music you   made this vocal performance this podcast whatever  it is it's always going to be someone looking at   you with judgment and not liking what you're doing  of course and it's taken me a long time to realize   you can have a million people saying oh I love  that video you know where where you were just   open and pure and you were crying and you were  being vulnerable and you can have like one person   go yeah like you're an attention seeker and our  ego goes hope what what yeah excuse me what yeah   can we can we what because I wasn't doing it for  that so yeah those triggers if we can get past   that it's a new level up of realizing that on on  these platforms that we have the ability to share   if we can get past that thing of releasing and  letting go and knowing there's going to be people   that don't like it yeah but the ripple effect  to the people who are ready to receive it yeah   that's what it's all about exactly yeah you're  gonna gravitate the people that get you like you   this is connected us yeah you know me being  vulnerable has connected us together because   it resonates with you in some way yeah because  you can see the humanness in it you know but of   course there's a lot of people that are not going  to understand and a big massive like shift in in   our growth personally is is accepting that it's  accepting like I want to be authentic so I have   to accept that lots of people are not gonna  like that but what would you rather be like   authentic and express yourself in a way that's  true to you or try and please everybody and   exhaust your spirit and exhaust yourself and  I've realized there's no better feeling than   being in like Integrity with yourself it's like  the most rewarding thing you can do and you end   up gravitating and magnetizing people that are  aligned with you and then the people that are   not just unfollow me oh don't watch my story  you know it doesn't mean that I have to please   you I'm not there to do that so but I I came  across something the other day it said like   you put a video out on social media and it'll  have X amount of views minimal likes yeah so it's   like people will watch what you're doing oh yeah  yeah of course you will but but they want to see   it yeah yeah yeah you don't want anyone follow  you yeah they want to see what you're about and   there's something that's intriguing but I don't  want to like it yeah I fully like what you're   about but yeah but at the same time it's super  intriguing so there's something really weird going   on in the psyche of like humans on social media  where I know algorithms obviously push things to   us yeah but there is people that you know will  sit on your personal platform and you might   trigger them but they won't unfollow you because  there's something in them that I think they   are probably getting something from you yeah on  some form and it is like when you choose to live   your truth and stand in your your own power of  creativity or how you choose to express yourself   if you're trying to be other versions of what you  think people want you to be like you said that is   so draining yeah and it's potent I think you can  smell in authenticity it's like you can see it in   my life and I can feel it when somebody's just  like not being authentic I can feel it when I'm   not being authentic and I don't like it I don't  like it it doesn't resonate with me you know but   I think as well we're all human like I judge  myself a lot of the time you know and so   I'm not going to sit here and deny that I've  looked at people's videos and I'll judge them   as well of course you know I'm we're all in this  we're all doing it well I'm not gonna like it yeah   we're all in it we're all in it but when I find  myself doing that I'm like what is it about this   person that I'm judging what's that triggering  inside of me like is it because she's so brave   that she's expressing herself in this way and I  haven't got the courage to do that or is it you   know what is it's bringing up some kind of Envy  or some what is it and because it's always about   us isn't it like when we're observing somebody  and it makes you feel a certain way yeah yeah   it's always a mirror of what it's showing us yeah  so it's an interesting like experiment to scroll   through and see what makes you feel something  and wonder wonder why I wonder what what that is   and we're like the first humans experiencing this  like years ago parents Generations before social   media you only had real real world interactions  or photographs TV yeah but now you can look at   everything all the time yeah and it's such a like  bombarding information overload to the brain and   one thing I've noticed with you as well even  though you'll be vulnerable and you'll share   and you'll be open you'll also be like okay  guys I'm taking a break from social media yeah   um I'll be back in however many weeks or however  long that time is what's the reason behind you   doing that I I do it the same but it's something  I need to practice more because I'm at a place now   where I feel myself getting triggered but one of  what I want to do instead of unfollowing people   straight away or taking a break I want to start  writing down what's triggering me and explore   the reasons behind them yeah yeah yeah before I  just go oh that doesn't feel nice so see you later   yeah because I'm into it exactly I'm not I'm not  trying to figure it out and process it and bring   it up and change it and let it go yeah what's the  reasons you take those breaks from social media   um well it takes up so much energy like for one  and I feel like as much as we can try and say oh   don't need external validation like social media  is based on external validation like that's what   it is and I'll hold my hands up and say like I get  that dopamine hit when someone like likes my thing   or when somebody comments everybody does and it  becomes addictive and it and it does over time I   think affect your what you put out affects you end  up trying to like mold yourself to be what people   want because more likes means more dopamine and  so even on a subconscious level like you end up   performing in some way and um when I noticed  that in myself like am I doing that have I   even had five minutes with myself before I want  to post have I took in this scenery like myself   before I've shared it with the world like when I  catch myself the the take the scales are tipping   the other way towards like performing to me having  my own experience with myself then I'm like okay   this is when I need to have a break you know and  and that's it always is the best thing ever like   having a break I I find though there's a balance  because the last time that I had a break was a   quite a long one it was maybe like three or four  months and then when I came back I didn't know how   to be I I couldn't go from being this super open  vulnerable like exposing myself person to then   coming back and be in that version again I was  like it's starting again yeah and like how could   I have been so vulnerable before how have I gone  from like not being on on this at all to like like   posting myself crying and having like a breakdown  on on social media it's just it's interesting it   sort of pulls you in but there's lots of people  working to make us crave this to make us need it   to make it like something that we spend all of  our energy on so they're doing a pretty good job I think I saw something about like Tick Tock and   the the scale of the emotions that you will  experience within like two minutes of being on   the app so then after watching that video I went  on Tick Tock and if that exact thing happened I   was watching like a comedy piece in stitches  laughing my head off next minute there was   like a dog that was dying and I was in tears and  what that video was saying is these quick Scrolls   don't allow you to feel into the emotion of pure  laughter and comedy in real life we'll laugh and   we'll laugh for a bit and then we'll feel good  and that'll settle down maybe 20 minutes late   you might talk about something sad and then we'll  be into emotion but we'll that will then fizzle   out and then we might have a laugh again yeah Tick  Tock is literally like 30 seconds happy 20 seconds   super sad 10 more seconds neutral yeah 10 seconds  sad and it's what that's doing too the first set   of humans that are doing this experiment of social  media I don't think we're going to figure out for   like Generations yeah because it's the first time  we're having this emotional swing and see sort of   happy sad happy sad neutral believe this don't  believe that it's such a strange thing and I   think those breaks are so necessary yeah I've I've  had them and then when when you're having a break   you're like I'm missing I'm like the craziest  thing is watching your thumb go to open an app   that you've taken off your phone that is crazy  that my thumb is programmed whether you wake up   or whatever when you first pick your phone up it's  trying to open Instagram but Instagram's not there   and I'm like wow that is that's worrying yeah yeah  we become an autopilot yeah but that's how Tik-Tok   um Keeps Us engaged doesn't it it's like because  I don't really use tick tock that much because   I feel like I give enough energy to Instagram  but um I noticed when I did get it last year I   think it was in lockdown actually it became like  everybody got Tick Tock didn't they in lockdown I found that I would be on it for like an hour I  would be really entertained for that hour but it   felt like five minutes that's crazy and it was  bizarre but that's like the crack for our man   mind isn't it it's like giving us all of this  dopamine and sending us on this roller coaster   and you get literally sucked into it it's work  it's like a Vortex like hands up admittedly the   other day my dog was up at like half five in the  morning needed to go out for a walk got with him   took him out come back managed to settle him I  couldn't then get settled so I went on my phone   went and Tick Tock and I was scrolling scrolling  scrolling I'm wide awake and I'm knowing this is   going to wake me up even more because it's like  really quick information yeah flying at my face in   a dark room with a bright light on and then before  I knew it was like half seven yeah and I went I've   just been on Tip Top for two hours what the [ __ ]  oh my God and I I closed my phone and put it down   I went that is ridiculous wow and I rolled over  and tried to score back to sleep and I did go back   to sleep for a couple of hours and it's like what  that's one thing you realize when you have a break   is how much time you spend on it I like you have  so many more hours in the day it's really worried   to get things done things just get done like yeah  that's one of the best things about about having   a break is you just become so much more present  yeah you have so much more space in your diary and   you've gained like five hours of your day and it's  some days you know it's like wow how could I spend   so much time on this device the worry of it is  it's like as beautiful it is where you can connect   with people like us and say hey do you want to  come and do the podcast yeah sure I think that   would be great and then this is going to go out to  people and hopefully affect them in a in a great   way but the danger is screen time I've had this  conversation recently like screen time if you've   got any screen time on your phone look at your  daily screen time let's say on average it might   be four hours for a normal person I've had times  doing lockdown I got up to like 11 hours a day   this is ridiculous and it'll be I'll be watching  stuff on YouTube yeah one up but add that up for   the week add it up for the month for the year it's  scary for a decade and then when you told me that   you didn't make your dreams happen yeah look at  why oh my God and honestly the numbers I'm gonna   do it on a podcast I do it now but I'm really  bad at maths so it's it'll be 77 hours a week   all right let's let's see okay let's say you're  on your phone for let's say five hours a day 35 hours a week yeah yeah and  then that's 140 hours a month   right I'm interested in you because I even  messed up 140 hours a month and then except me   not trusting you're still doing it oh my God  and then a year 1004 00 1 600 and something   1600 680 hours yeah and then if you do that oh  my God even even that is just scary isn't it in days that is 70 days out of the Year  looking at your phone now imagine someone   said I need you to look at your phone for 70  days straight with no break no out of a year   and that's only five hours a day yeah so  people are getting you know screen time   Way Beyond that and what could you  apply those five hours if you only   limited your time to one hour a day  yeah five hours of chasing dreams and you know I do get really positive things  from Tick Tock like I said this license it's when I when I took a step back and I was  like right this is my screen time for the year   if somebody locked me in a room and said stare  at your phone for this amount of time no breaks   that's terrifying yeah it is the amount of  time I'd probably die yeah you check out after   a bit you bet it's too much um but yeah that's  ridiculous and but yeah I don't also want to like   say all the bad things about social media because  it's given me so many things you know in terms of   like connections jobs like beautiful opportunities  and creative creatively speaking as well like   there's loads of positive things about it it's  up to us to have that um like uh discipline   discipline with ourselves to be able to to say no  this is enough now yeah and also to put things out   there that are meaningful like that's also quite  important I think even if it means something just   to you like it doesn't have to mean anything  to the world but if it's meaningful then you   feel like oh I've made this memory that's always  going to be there on my feed or you know giving   things meaning rather than look at me I look  sexy today I always think what's crazy as well   is like I always think about future Generations  so imagine you're a great great grandkids can see   what you were doing yeah in like 2022 yeah and  this is what one thing we're not aware of like   what our future Generations are going to see what  we're like for you know the content we're putting   out and I'm not sure of that from like an ego  perspective I'm like oh I want my great great   grandkids to love me but it's like I want them to  know I did something with my time here yeah that   tried to like be positive do you think that people  are gonna be on Instagram in great great grandkids   time not not on the platform but I think there'll  be something that archives where you can go right   Jamie Lou 2022. okay oh my God that was my great  great yeah yeah yeah yeah like she's twerking and   doing the splits like she loves she loved that or  look she's crying and being vulnerable and it's   it's not something we think about because it's  all it's so new to us yeah that we're not thinking   like imagine being able to find your great great  Granddad and what you was physically doing and   moving like and talking like and who his friends  were what his friends did yeah and you start to   build this whole picture of the past it's going  to be a trip for future Generations that's true   that's true I never actually thought about like  that I always think in the future we'll just be   like flying yeah flying and having like robots  and by the way I've not seen James work or do   the splits I was just like me saying like a random  thing is not probably what you'll find if you go   on a page it depends what she's feeling that day  exactly but is it such like a it's such a strange   tool I've been able to be creative vulnerable  expressive and not letting it suck you in and   like comparison is the devil on that oh yeah  comparisons to devil in life in general isn't it   and social media completely amplifies that doesn't  it for everyone because you can see everyone else   yeah but most people on social media look at  their own profile more than anyone else is I   think like they're looking at who's looked at the  story like what their pictures are what they're   gonna post I think anyway I mean I spend more time  thinking about what I'm gonna put out there than   scrolling through other people so it's just  interesting how we just we think that people are   watching us and it affects our Behavior it's just  like a big Mindful and the people deciding what   your algorithm is so like on Instagram I think you  want to get shown five to ten percent of like if   you put poster it's only going to five percent ten  percent of your followers wow so not everyone's   seeing who you are and what you're about and vice  versa so you're you're getting shown the same   people again and again yeah and then that's this  Echo chamber like luckily I'm showing someone like   you and you know people who resonate with what I'm  about as a human but even that is like a danger   that you forget that there is people really just  there oh will allow Jamie to see this this and   this yeah and then you're consuming it's like  without realizing your mind is being shaped by   you know what you're what you're taking in yeah  and that is decided by someone else it's not this   free loving you get to see all your followers or  everyone you follow you see all their content yeah   it doesn't work like that so it is it's having  that awareness of using the app rather than the   apps using you yeah totally and I suppose that  goes like the same with the mind as well you know   you say you know your mind will renew if you don't  learn how you know control it and it's the same   as social media yeah and as I'm saying this to  you I'm saying it to myself it's like a constant   reminder to to make sure I'm checking myself  because sometimes the screen time is crazy and   if you're with your friends to the listeners I see  if you're out for having a meal or you're around   having lunch just say hey as a little laugh let's  all just see what our screen times are and check   each other on it because it is a terrifying thing  when you actually look at it yeah that's crazy   whoever's the highest pay for lunch yeah something  like that but it is it's scary how much time we're   on these on these things when you know you've got  things to do and you've got dreams to chase yeah   but the beauty is like I said seeing you share  things and I know you you had a big Journey when   you were thinking about going to IB for and I  think maybe you even shared that on social media   yeah should I go should I stay yeah and I think  I was like do it and I'm sure you had loads of   people you know say the same even though probably  your close friends and family we're gonna miss you   but what was that decision like had you had lived  in IB for before or was this a brand new Venture   that you were going out there to pursue something  new um so I lived in Ibiza actually when I was 20.   I went there for six months and it was the best  six months of my entire life it just like opened   my mind to so much and I made my best friends  in the world that was one of those situations   as well where it was like trust the process  because in to everyone else it looked and even   maybe to me it was like I was running away from  Manchester in a way I was like I want something   new I want to enjoy myself I want to like not get  caught up in this like constructs that we live in   where you should be this at this stage in your  life by a certain age and everybody's speeding   up growing up and I'm like I've only just started  being a child like I'm not I'm not gonna grow up   anytime soon like I'm not ready for this so I went  to a beef and it just opened up my heart mind soul   throughout through being around like many people  that had the same spirit and um me and my best   friend now we started to wake up we weren't awake  we just thought we was at that age you know but we   started to ask questions like about life and about  the meaning of life and about questions that I'd   never even 3 A.M I'd be before oh yeah oh yeah you  know those ones those questions those questions   are super powerful though like they're really  important questions to ask and because you can't   answer them but it creates curiosity doesn't  it and it makes you think outside the box so   Ibiza always had like a really special place in my  heart and I was going back there like year after   year on holidays and stuff and then when kovid  here and I was self-employed and I didn't have   any work on I was literally watching Game of  Thrones I'd not watched it until uh covered so   I was like yeah yeah I spent like three weeks  watching that drinking red wine I get jealous   when people say I've started this and I've never  watched it I'm like oh do you know that feeling to   be discovering that show again from the beginning  it was amazing I had to start a lot down that's   like you couldn't think of anything but I know  I know it was it was saving it for for that time   obviously and then I was with some girlfriends  doing like a women's circle like that's one of   the things that have really helped support me  and that my challenges in life is connecting   to women because it's a really safe space to be  vulnerable and that's also a thing that helps   me be vulnerable on social media because I know  that a lot of men are not gonna get it yeah you   know and I get that but a lot of women do because  we all feel the same things I'm not special like   we all feel so emotional and sad especially  women I know men do as well but I think we're   stereotypically a bit more emotional than men and  so it I know that there's a lot of women that see   me in that vulnerable side and support me and they  get it yeah so I have like a nice support network   of women and um on this day one of my friends  just said why don't you go to Ibiza and it was   just like oh yeah yeah it's just click thank you  yeah I'm going and uh then I was like oh should I   go am I being too rational like I just put up with  somebody as well so I was like uh but then I just   ended up going and I was really really committed  to staying there as well like I went there like   all in as I do anything that I choose to do I'm  always like 100 committed until I'm not and then   when I'm not I'm like okay it's time for something  new now but when I'm there I'm fully there so   ibiza's got this kind of mystical Spirit to it  where if you commit to the Island the island   commits to you and it just Embraces you it's a  special place it is isn't it it's just magical and   so uh yeah it just was like a roller coaster when  I look back it's like I was sat I arrived in Ibiza   was sat on a roller coaster went on this amazing  ride and then got off and come back and it just   feels like that do you know during that time like  watching someone's story like on Instagram you get   so invested it's like you're watching a TV show  that you like come back into every now and then   there's little things like you the car you had out  there breaking down and it's crazy how I know so   much of your journey by just seeing it just being  on Instagram and going oh my is that you're just   seeing like a little two minute clip of someone  like once a week or you know when you're sharing   yeah and you know you learn in Spanish and sharing  this whole journey it is like amazing that we can   see these journeys of people when you choose to  share it and it does trigger loads of things in   yourself like oh I wish I you know could go and do  that and it's not that you can't everyone can go   and do whatever but it's so with you can get bits  of inspiration and figure out how that can fit   into your life or it might not look like me being  a yoga team to move into Ibiza to teach yoga but   when you share Journeys like definitely does  inspire and makes you wanna you know go and   pursue something in some way yeah of course  knowing how magical ibifer isn't seeing that you   know you were teaching yoga learning Spanish and  it's like it's a lot like such a a great life like   from my perspective yeah she live in it and when I  said go do it and you do it and I'm like I'd love   to see that yeah it was amazing it was like the  best two years of my life because I feel like it   was just soothing muscle in every way being like  super connected to Nature connected to like-minded   people just embraced by the island itself you know  just meeting wonderful people from all walks of   life that you wouldn't meet in Manchester like  a beast is like a place where everybody in the   world goes to yeah you know so you meet people  from all over the world like my best friends were   not from England like my group of friends were not  from England so it was really nice to be exposed   to different cultures and just to understand  different human beings like that fascinating yeah I see you share things like I think one time  you were like oh I'm heading off into the woods   for like a couple of days I won't be on Instagram  or something and I'm like for me I'm like I wonder   what the what's in our beef will look like because  obviously I've never been in the woods in ibif   I've been to IB you've spent time there but I'm  like I'd love to see what that looks like and but   probably is like yo what you're doing you're  taking a tent like I wanted to know more I'm   super intrigued but yeah yeah these Journeys and  then you just pop up like at some point you know   sharing something else after but what did those  little trips look like to you and IB for like   the non-traditional because I when we say IB for  we're not seeing IB for you there partying every   day like you know living that life of Ibiza it's  really you tapping into the magic of that Island   Bridge when you've been you really feel I didn't  go till I was 30 and when I got there I was like   how have I missed all in this for so long my wife  had been doing it yeah and what is what did that   side of ibifa look like when you're going off into  the woods and spending a couple of days I think   even on on your own yeah like completely alone  what yeah I know so uh as much as Ibiza is amazing   like it's incredible everything has Darkness and  Light yeah me you yeah and Ibiza and this is a   book title the stimulation like you're constantly  stimulate it be that from the Sun the sea the   people you meet like the constant entertainment  like everybody being so open and wanting to take   you places and I guess like I was attracting  a lot of the energy that I was putting out   so people were I was always busy you know I was  always like meeting new people and blah blah blah   and um that gets a lot after a while I was like  I've been here for four months and I've not had   one day to myself like I've I don't even know  any of these people properly you know when you're   getting your own head and you're just like I  don't even know how to get these people like   who am I again Anita really need  to spend some time on my own and   um this this guy that I was seeing who's a friend  of mine now Lorenzo he'd been on the island for   10 years and so I met him and he just showed  me so many like gems of the island and that   was like such a gift for me because he took me  to all of the places that people who I knew had   lived there for six years never been never been  to within my first few months so I was like oh   my God this is perfect and he took me to this  place at the in the top of the island and uh   I just knew that I wanted to spend some time there  on my own it was his like people in Ibiza who know   the hidden gems get a bit territorial  so he was like this is this is my place   but yeah I'm gonna go and spend time yeah  two days on my own then yeah exactly so I   um I went there and it was just amazing it was  kind of cold it was in November and I took a   tent I took like a pad and paper and writ 80  pages of journaling like I filled a pad full   of all of the things that it was a trip for me  for like that four months was incredible I had   an insane time but I just had so many stories to  write down so I wrote all of that and then I went   swimming every day and I was trying to get away  from the parties because although I wasn't going   to the clubs they weren't open I was still going  to like Gatherings and partying way more than I   would here just because of the abundance  of things that are going on all the time   and uh it's just in the spirit there isn't it yeah  every day's a party you can't escape no and you   don't want to either like it's like why I'm not  I'm not drinking I'm like I'm enjoying myself I'm   just dancing and it's but even after a while of  that I was just a bit tired of it but anyway at   day four of this I did 10 days by the way yeah  well I say on my own that was the intention   and then after um five days it was getting  a bit cold I think the temperature dropped   quite a lot in the night but at that point  and I just this is like quite a remote beat   and November's classed as winter so  there's hardly anyone there in Ibiza   and I just saw this like canoe canoe kayak kayak  coming down like the hill with two men holding   one end and it was filled with booze and like  food and then like 20 Argentinian people coming   down so I thought oh my gosh like do I hide I'm  just like here alone that's such a predicament   I would get myself in like they see me trying  to hide another light oh it's so awkward but   um obviously I couldn't I couldn't hide so I just  said hello and then they asked me what I was doing   and they were super interesting Argentinian  people are the most like wonderful spirited   people have ever met it was the first time that  I'd ever been like in close contact with them   and after a while at first I was resistant like  you guys have ruined my meditation but then I was   just like whatever I'm gonna go with this and just  enjoy myself with these people so I was just like   partying and dancing and enjoying myself for a day  with them and they gave me a quilt they gave me that's what's happened to me Time After Time  After Time Again is when I have trusted the   process the process has said thank you for thank  you for trusting me here you go there's a gift   it's like take the leap and the net will appear  that you you're always gonna be all right and   it's really hard to say that to someone because  there's so much fear but try it you know just   try it you're all you're always going to be  rewarded for trusting in in the process like   I've found anyway yeah something so much better  than you could ever imagine will show up if you   just take that leap of faith it's a cliche take  a leap of face but there's so much truth in all   of these cliches that we have it's like a rule  of life if you're brave enough to take the leap   then you will be rewarded nobody who is like  influential successful like Legends nobody has   got there without taking some kind of leap of  faith and trusting the process and having like   a a sort of confidence in in themselves and in  the adventure of life and you know knowing that   there's more to it than the rat race there's more  to it than working every day for someone else and   like watching other people live their dreams you  deserve the the life of your dreams just as much   as as everyone else does so it's just having the  faith in that I guess it's so true and also I feel   like it's Society programs and conditions you to  feel out right I'm gonna go and move to Ibiza I   don't know what that looks like and I might be  back at some point it's not like I'm going to   Ibiza and if I've come back I've failed yeah of  course there's so much pressure on people that   make these choices and decisions to try something  new if you end up back where you came from yeah I   didn't work you didn't you didn't do well and  it's sometimes it's not about that it's just   yeah you need to go and experience that thing like  you're back here now and who's to say you won't be   somewhere else in six months or a year yeah and  that's what we've got to get out of our head in   in society that have to try something it doesn't  work yeah that's okay yeah yeah yeah it's leading   you to the thing that will be right for you all  that experience is exactly what you needed at that   time yeah and when you were down on that beat did  you know you were going to go and do 10 days or   were you just like rolling with it I plan to do 11  days actually but then by the 10th day I just had   enough it was like it was the right time for me to  to finish it so initially I wanted to do 11 days   I just I just got that number in my head from from  somewhere I don't know where it was but after that   I just felt amazing it was like I had showed that  I had so much resilience like I just enjoyed doing   the simple things like the rituals of swimming  every day making my food but collecting wood   making a fire every night oh wow this is a novel  it was amazing it was it's like super amazing and   there was this little cat that came it was like  the most remote peach in Ibiza bought this cat   that came and said hello to me every morning when  I was doing my yoga practice and yeah just it was   just like a a special moment for me I didn't even  have my phone or anything so it was just beautiful   and that's trust in the process because obviously  like I could be afraid that somebody's gonna come   and kidnap me or I'm a woman you know being in  the in the forest of my own so there's loads of   fears that I had to just say no I trust it this is  what I need to do for myself for my soul I wanted   to do a vapassana like a 10-day silent meditation  yeah I've wanted to do that for a really long time   but this was my way of like doing a vapassana for  myself because it was covered they weren't doing   the passengers so I have lots of those in the  past and I've always like you know checked out   the very news or the locations and I'm like  it'd be so interesting to go and do it and   something's always just stop me as of as I've you  know taken that leap and I think that's something   I definitely want to do probably next year is some  type of retreat whether it's a silent Retreat I'm   not sure but something where you just putting  yourself in a different environment tapping out   a society for a bit Yeah and just tapping in with  yourself and connecting with yourself yeah and   a lot of people don't ever do that I know in a  lifetime I know it's scary that's uh that's uh   tapping out and having a break but when do  you ever just connect with you and I spoke   about another podcast you know self-love what that  looks like not not going on a walk with somebody   and I know you do this a lot as well you'll go  and walk on your own yeah I have found this to   be one of the most beneficial things ever for  me I love walking with my friends and chatting   I love that as well I love when you're with  friends and you get past that 20 minute Mark   and then you find yourself all in silence that's  amazing when you realize that everyone is just   trickling out and shutting down and letting go  yeah of feeling the need of having to fill space   with conversation completely and when you can get  to that when you're with people it's amazing but I   found walking on my own such a beautiful process  of like literally Feeling High at the end of it   like like I've been smoking or doing some type  of drug do you know what I mean like outside just   from walking and listening to music yeah and these  little acts that we can do and they shape you   and relax you and help you in this we're living  quite a hard world I think quite a dense time   informations you know left and right up and down  all the times you don't know what to believe and   I feel like it's designed for it to be like  that so we are living in a state of confusion   so we need to find that time to tap into yourself  without any external influence and you do that a   lot and you do it and I'll let you talk about  this because you're the you're the master of   this world compared to me but no you'll do it  like you know in terms of mushrooms and micro   dosing do you want to explain to the listeners  of like how you got into that world and what   that looks like to you now and if someone like  myself is like wanting to get into it how you   would tip toe into that process of opening  up to the world of of mushrooms and I'm not   talking the ones that you're chopping up in you  know something like that yeah um so I wouldn't   necessarily recommend anyone to to do mushrooms  because I think it's a personal thing for everyone   but you can just read the literature now and  the science and see the successful people that   are talking about them to know that they  are just incredible if used in the right   way my personal experience it took me a while  to like open myself up to mushrooms because   there's this stigma with psychedelics that they  turn you into like crazy and like wild and yeah   you know you become like one of those people that  wears like old leopard print pants with a stripy   top and a fluffy hat and walk to the shop with  orange hair and all of that mad stuff watch me   start doing mushrooms and that's exactly right  because well there's nothing wrong with that   there's nothing wrong with that at all but like  there's a there is a stigma attached to it that   you become like a little bit wild and crazy it's  that term that we said you know before we spoke   about this the hippie yeah these terms that  are used to like apply something negative to a   positive change and has that been used over time  to stop people delving into things and language   is a powerful tool to you know direct people away  from positive things and found that a lot over the   years as I've been opening up and not relating to  mushrooms but you know changing and growing as a   person people say these things to you ingest yeah  but there's something that as you change You're   triggering Something in them while they're being  stagnant in their own current existence which is   fine people arrive at different destinations when  they're ready but I do feel like this language has   been used against people like you know like  trying things and yeah it's always seen as a   negative thing in it like mushrooms are records  people that want to get off their heads but yeah   you can see now society and people are sharing and  trying you know go into circles and ceremonies and   people like yourself that are going on walks and  micro dosing or even dosing yeah like and going on   walks and exploring nature it really is happening  and now the science is there yeah so it's like the   people that are going to name call it's like hey  you're the ones that need science yeah exactly   all right so here's the science and we'll just be  like I told you so it's a journey I'm definitely   like I've done mushrooms in the past but not on  an active level where it's it's constantly in my   system and seeing it as a medicine rather than  a let me let me see what this high is like yeah   um something that just came up when you said that  is that the use of language and a big word that   people like get really taken aback by is drugs  like uh mushrooms are drugs uh alcohol is a drug   like obviously all of those things that we have  in what people have in their bathroom cabinet   are drugs but because somebody who we don't  know who doesn't want you to take mushrooms   that grow from the earth has said that's a drug  that's illegal that that it just obviously puts   everybody into that fair State nobody listens  to themselves and thinks this is growing on   the earth I mean nobody's died ever died from  it people have amazing experience it makes you   happier but it's illegal like how does that even  make sense it's actually mind-blowing it's crazy   it's it's literally crazy so that's not another  thing trust not just trusting the process but   trust yourself like does that make sense that  that's illegal it doesn't make sense to me and   so I've always been a little bit rebellious  in my mentality and if something doesn't seem   right to me I'm not gonna buy it it's like yeah  I don't believe you I don't know you so why am I   gonna take your word for it you know I'll do  my own research and that's what I started to   do when I was younger it's like 21 I started to  be curious about psychedelics just after coming   back from a Visa actually I had not taken any  any mushrooms or anything then that year but   I was going to Thailand in the the winter and  so I started to sort of be curious and do loads   of research about like the the benefits and  what psychedelics do and I took them for the   first time in Thailand that's that winter and  I just had a deeply profound experience but it   was an experience that was like it kind of put my  back up against the wall this is why I wouldn't   recommend it to everyone willy-nilly I would say  be careful because just because psychedelics are   very very powerful substances so I was like whoa  okay I'm in a different kind of Dimension here   not not like different world I'm still here but  it's like there's a glaze over over this reality   that's more magical more more animated more  [Music] um interactive with nature so I was   aware of that and I realized from that very first  time that these are not something that I want to   take recreationally this is something that's got  a lot of power a lot of information to give me and   I have to respect it because yeah otherwise it  could go wrong and I think everybody who I has   ever said they had a bad trip the three things you  should probably ask is what environment was you in   did you 100 want to take them before you did or  was you like convinced to do it and like what   was you combining it with was you drunk was you  stuck high was you you know did you eat crap that   day all of these things that affects the trip that  you have like massively so um yeah from that first   experience I think I waited like even two years to  have them again and it just became like something   that I would do every couple of years or every  now and again over the last two years living in   Ibiza and even before that it would be something  that I do to to I call it to top myself or for   to reset so every three months I will Deep dive  and have a have a trip and it's always like a big   shift in Emotion for me like I just I'm able  to reset I'm able to see things from a clearer   perspective and they're just for me like one  of the biggest teachers in my life because I've   healed from so much drama and let go of so much  stuff and just find the lightness in so much from   from psychedelics so they're a gift and even  like going on walks and finding them it's just   I find that whole process really healing before  you even eat them you know just walking finding   them and they're mysterious little beings you know  they're always on the path you'll be walking or   a path over there so it's like it's mind-blowing  when you think about it yeah like how many humans   what started the process of that becoming illegal  yeah what happened at what point of time for some   government or controlling authority to say this  is getting out of hand yeah people really must   have been leveling up yeah quite quickly I believe  so I think it was around like the time of Martin   Luther King and the hippies and that's when LSD  became huge and that the hippie culture became   massive yeah and then it just all got stopped like  all of the funding for all of the research just   got stopped one day and so this is where breath  work actually speaking became like a big thing   from them because I I forget the scientist's  name now but he realized that you can get to   the spaces that you can get to with psychedelics  through breath work so he started to Branch out   into into breath work because there was no longer  allowed to do this psychedelic research obviously   people still did it like ramdas and like all  these Psychonauts they still carry on doing it   um but yeah I just think that in 10 20 years  all of these stigmas that we've we've attached   to psychedelics will be lifted and it will  just be like what a gift they help people to   be happier and healthier and think outside of  the box and less judgmental and so yeah I find   them wonderful she's been suppressed because  at that time the music industry was shifted on   purpose as well to end that psychedelic sound  and it it shifted into a completely different   space and energy and there's people that you can  find documentaries on YouTube about that time of   you know the the hippie movement when people  were opening up and mindsets were changing it   was all about love and you know experimentation  and expression it was a conscious Collective   effort to shift people out of that so you know  Banning the substances being undertaken change   the music they're listening to or the direction  of it because the labels have control to do that   yeah and it literally how long ago was that that's  a long time ago you know I mean 60 60 years and   it's now everyone's rediscovering it again it's  like how long can you suppress something for so   it'd be interesting to see whether it opens  up hopefully it does people are more open to   it or whether there'll be a wave of trying to  suppress it again when people do really start   delving in and waking up together yeah yeah  because it is a medicine if you're growing on   the planet it's a medicine exactly it can be  a medicine and a poison though that's why I   wouldn't want to like persuade everybody to do it  and I would never do that because everything can   be a medicine and a person that you can't just see  the positive sides of things in the wrong context   a psychedelic trip could be awful you know so I  think they're always being cautious and having   awareness of things is just super important with  powerful substances yeah but it just makes me feel   confused about society when people are willing to  pay God knows how much a cocktail is in Manchester   now I think like 12 quid or something people are  willing to spend like 150 quid on a night out to   feel like [ __ ] the next day maybe even for like  the next three days myself included sometimes   and they don't see that as poison in themselves  or affecting the mental health negatively because   it's such a normal thing to do in society we  don't see that as um damaging ourselves just   because somebody says it's legal and it's normal  but going for a walk in nature on your own and   eating something that comes from the ground  is classed as taking drugs and crazy it just   it's interesting it's an interesting perspective  but it doesn't make sense and I feel like that's   the planet we live on everything's inverted yeah  so the things that make sense to people actually   don't make sense and vice versa yeah and hopefully  we'll we'll transcend out of that and hopefully   it's the things like like mushrooms and US tapping  back into nature yeah maybe that's the only way we   will wake up out of this denseness that is the  current state of the human existence obviously   I'm saying that from a very privileged place  of living in the UK with you know in a country   that's financially stable even though it's a  crazy time at the same time by the standard of   this country yeah and all these people around the  world that you know are way worse suffering but in   terms of the planet in itself I think we live  in quite a dense existence yeah because we've   distance ourselves from our nature yeah  completely we've literally been programmed   and shaped by probably a huge influence of you  know technology and things we consume via that   and I think maybe the only way to go out that is  by what we actually consume that nature gives us   and tapping back into that of course when you do  take mushrooms you feel so connected to Nature   it's like you you understand that you are a part  of nature it's just like it's a very so you don't   the trees don't talk to you but it's a very subtle  like communication it's like you feel part of the   earth you feel a part of Nature and it's such a  such a beautiful feeling you know like the last   thing you want to do is look at your phone one  you can't read it anyway most of the time but   you don't want to be involved with technology you  want to be involved with like Yeah The Universe   And if you do that thing feels so wrong and  so alien like what is that right now yeah yeah   yeah can't do that that's going to send me down  the wrong way and it is something that like I'm   definitely going to get into more I've done it in  the past my first time with Thailand as well okay   typical full moon party yeah like drunk high  oh let me do let me do mushrooms as well but   I remember standing on the beach and I was with  a group of people I was traveling on my own but   I was with like a probably a good 10 12 people and  I just walked into the water like shin height and   I was just looking at the ocean and everything was  just vibrant and colorful and I was like what this   is not alcohol but I didn't know the true essence  of what the mushroom experience was because I was   drinking all night or smoking all night so I  didn't have that true experience with it and   I've had little experiences along the way but  not enough now where I want to start using it   as medicine rather than oh let me do this because  other people are doing it or let me do this and   see how I feel now it's like I'm seeing people  like yourself and other people online and you   know the the scientists the professionals that  are showing you this is how you do this yeah to   open yourself up to something new and in existence  that we don't yet all know exactly and mother   nature is really intelligent really smart like  we come from that so we don't even understand   the intelligence of our body like nowhere near so  we can't understand the intelligence of of these   mushrooms but we can trust them and they are so  intelligent like I was thinking this why do they   come out in autumn uh why would a mushroom come  out in Autumn obviously the environment is perfect   for them to come out then but it's also around  the time where we're about to experience like five   months of darkness like five months of sad and  all of these like negative emotions that people   experience in winter so it's a perfect time to  top people up like to reset people and maybe the   hunter-gatherers and the people that would have  hit them and they had none of these legislations   they knew that oh this is a gift from Mother  Earth that's popping up at this time just when   we need it to you know what I mean it makes sense  it's all like divinely orchestrated I believe and   so yeah I don't know if you look at how  like mushrooms are connected and you   know stuff I've watched over the years  and you sit there and you're like what   and there was something I think it was like  maybe a a Japanese subway system oh yeah and   fungi yeah and they've obviously done whatever  and you know Place fungi in in the same layout   of what the subway system is like a model  version of it and this thing has has grown   and figured out the fastest route to one point  to another yeah but then also started to redesign   the subway system so it's it's more like more  efficient more efficient no I know I was blown   away this is one of the videos that I watched  when I was trying to convince myself to to take   them yeah and I saw that and I was like oh my gosh  and then the stone date Theory yeah that's Paul's   name and Joe Rogan all of these people that have  like really convinced they convinced me because   they know what they're talking about they're not  just like random people raving about it so yeah   um I'm just really grateful for them actually and  I also had this I think it's quite vulnerable to   talk about psychedelics because you're still  kind of I know that it's accepted and in Ibiza   everybody's doing them and it's still like it's  it's still quite a stigmatized subject but I feel   like I want to talk about them now because they've  given me so much in my life and I know that they   have so much to offer like the world so I want to  I want to speak about them in a way like because   I think why should you should be ashamed of  something that's genuinely helped you just because   of what other people are going to think about  you yeah you know so they've helped me and I'm   an advocate for them like for myself so why would  I hide that no one should tell you anything about   your reality and your experience and it is again  going back to the same thing we keep saying trust   in the process of speaking the truth and sharing  it and knowing this is going to connect with   with people and knowing there's going to be people  there that don't agree with what you're saying and   think you're absolutely off your Russia and that's  okay yeah that's okay it's people get to live the   lives and explore new things and we're here trying  to help people do the same and you know take leaps   of faith and you know delve into new things and  not get stuck in a stagnant existence while we're   here for a very short life exactly yeah we're here  for a minimal amount of time do we get to go again   I'm not sure I believe personally maybe we do  but that's a completely different episode yeah   yeah but it is it's beautiful to see you know  people opening up sharing and you know Finding   communities to do that with and create safe spaces  and I know you you do that you know with the   women's circles yeah it's great to see that from  the outside and I said this on another podcast   um you know looking at these circles they  look they look great from the outside yeah   yeah they are I'm a man how do I get in  because I want to experience a bit of   that but I do fully respect you know that that  you guys share something in those spaces that   is needed amongst yourselves of course in this  world when we're living in a very strange time   for women over the years you know we've had  multiple things happen and we won't delve into it   too deep but women still live a very like fearful  existence on this planet into here you you know   go to IB for choose to spend 10 days on your own  and overcome those fears knowing that what women   have to experience as an existence and then see 20  strangers approaching you on the beach that moment   there I can only process that as a man and as a  man for me that is right I'm gonna have to either   hide yeah like you said be seen hiding and be  super awkward or if this goes the wrong way I   I'm gonna have to get physical yeah and that's  that's a man stance and from a woman's stance   even though you can get physical if there's  people in front of you that are physically   built differently yeah it must be such a a a  different existence and I feel like it's great   when you see you know women coming together and  expressing and sharing because there is still a   lot of fear around just existing as a woman you  know when when for example my mum will come here   um at the weekends and she'll take  the dog home for the weekend and   I worry about her walking the dog at night  in the winter because I'm like it's just my   mum out in the world walking the dog yeah  and I don't ever have to I can be out here   at three four in the morning I don't really  worry too much I'm StreetWise so I'm wearing   my surroundings but I'm not like oh I'm gonna  get kidnapped yeah it's just not part of like   what we have to really worry about as a man so I  suppose it is amazing for you know to hear these   stories from yourself and living in in your  power even though there is that fear there   and it must take a lot of courage to do that  well I was raised in Ashton underlying yeah I'm good I'm good yeah exactly so and IP for  God you you yeah I mean I don't know I just   there's certain things that I'm just not afraid  of in that sense maybe that's a little bit naive   because but it's never got me in trouble so far  I think there is a fine line between trusting   and also being a little bit naive it's never  got me in trouble where I've got myself into   like a really dodgy situation yeah maybe  once or twice actually thinking about it   um but I think it's much easier to trust people  I find that it's much better to trust people that   opens up so many more opportunities if you see  the best in someone than to close off because   you're afraid that's always paid off for me um and  just yet about these women's circles this is what   women have been doing for like thousands of years  in every culture in every tribe in India in Africa   in Scandinavia women are gathering round circles  to talk to each other and to heal each other and   it you don't even have to talk about much it's  not like casting spells or The Cauldron and all of   that stuff it's just talking about what's what's  true for you and I feel like as well one thing I   don't want to go too much into women but we're  our culture is designed to make women compete   against each other and we live in a competitive  world I guess is some kind of competitiveness in   our nature because we we want to find a man or  we want to get a job or whatever it's there for   sure but that's definitely Amplified within this  comparison and social media yeah and so creating   these spaces it just allows women to to express  their vulnerabilities and to praise each other   and to see that all of these insecurities that we  have in these fears and these like little jealousy   things that come up and like she's skinnier  than me she's more beautiful me blah blah blah   it's we all have those feelings and it's much  more beautiful to celebrate someone than it is   to to like say something bad about them yeah I  think that's what actually makes you beautiful   is being able to approach someone and give them a  compliment and just to like get on board with them   and so it releases so much fear and it's really  really helped heal me it's like therapy I've   been like sitting there with your girlfriends and  it gives you this courage to be like yeah I can   show my vulnerable side because I'm a woman I'm  obviously feeling this like this way so I'm why   not share it so yeah they're just the best thing  ever I'm gonna do one for my 30th birthday it's   like my gift to myself yeah it's it's obviously  you look and you compare as a man I'm like   I know I've learned since that you know there  is men out there doing circles but obviously   the difference of the to the women's circles  and it is I've I grew up with my mum so like I   like being around female energy I've always been  that way love being around my boys I absolutely   love it but I get a lot of like nurture and  knowledge from females in my life I think I   said this yesterday I had a time where I had  a really guilty moment where I'm on I'm online   for years maybe even a decade you know I'm getting  information left right and Center helping me grow   I was I just came to a point where it's all  coming from males because I've got no female   inspirational knowledge influence coming into  my life and I was like that's a worry but I   know I'm still quite tapped into my feminine  side like I don't shy away from it it took me   about three four months before I realized that  it's my real world connections where I get the   feminine energy and intuition and knowledge and  healing and nurture okay I get it all from the   real world and I was like I'm good I've got the  balance yeah yeah but I started to beat myself up   about it because I was like I'm getting too much  of one thing than not the other yeah yeah yeah   that I feel like people should seek that  out especially men if you're in certain   environments and it's just male like sink  the opposite always see the opposite yeah   because we need the balances as humans to have  that yeah well-roundedness and I feel like   women do that so well when you know they create  a circle and you see as an outsider you know the   things that the participating in and I'm thinking  how tough would it be to get a group of men to let   go do an ecstatic dance could I see that happening  I'm not sure I'm sure it would but to get like my   boys doing that I feel like it would like take  half a lifetime yeah and there's so much work to   do and I'm not even at that point it would take  me a lot I think to be in a room of strangers   and fully let go and not care about what people  think we've got a lifetime of stuff to undo yeah   that's what we've got to remember not to be hard  on ourselves we're undoing as we're learning but   if you break it down like being in the room  and just dancing like that's not that's not a   difficult thing to do is it like I mean physically  but mentally that's like no way I can't do that   everybody can do it's like meditating it's the  most simple thing to do in the world just sit   there and and shut up and close your eyes yes I'm  sure how do you meditate sit there [ __ ] exactly   sit there shut up close your eyes focus on your  breath and wake there that's the next episode it's   gonna be like 10 seconds long how to meditate  sit there and shut up so you know steps no but   you know I mean it's like these simple things  are like there's so much resistance within us   to do is that complicates it yeah exactly and  uh yeah I just want to try and make my life as   simple as possible yeah but trust in the process  and it never actually had any role models growing   up as well that's something that's allowed me to  trust the process sorry I'm diverting a bit but I   was just thinking then like you had your your mom  and your family and I didn't really have anyone to   look up to yeah I had role models in the sense I  don't want to end up like that so that's in kind   of in a role model in a way yeah yeah it's just  a perception of negative and positive it is like   make sure you don't go that way yeah don't make  this those mistakes so yeah and but I use social   media and podcasts and these kind of mediums to  find my role models and to learn from from people   and that's something honestly I couldn't you know  when I've been in really tough places I'll do one   or two things I'll have a stick of comedy on and  laugh yeah and just let the laughter be and you   know it's those odd sorry those old sayings you  know laughter is the best medicine it really is   like I would even be on my own I just watch Comedy  and just laugh laugh or I'll go in and I'll watch   something that's going to feed me and nourish  me and finding those people in your life that   have spent time or a lifetime you know researching  mushrooms or the people of Joe Rogan will have in   his podcast or someone like Russell Brand or Muji  Muji really opened up my mindset and changed me I   used to spend hours every day just watching that  guy and listening to him yeah to the point I was   gonna go to India and like try and get on one of  his songs because I was like I need to be in front   of that guy I relate to him because he's like a  Jamaican that moved to Britain that moved to India   that became a guru and it's like culturally I  just relate to him so much from how he sounds and   he's been here so he understands our culture  British culture but he's Jamaican and he just he's   such a well-rounded cultured person that he shaped  my mind completely and the fact we live in a day   and age where we can do that just put something  on and listen yeah it's so powerful yeah and you   just people just need to find what's right for  them and and Trust the process yeah yeah exactly   I like to think like a podcast or listening to a  podcast it's like you're having dinner with that   person or lunch and imagine sitting there having  lunch and listening to this person like share all   of this knowledge with you it's like wow so yeah  it's like you're having a meeting with with Joe   Rogan with Jordan Peterson you can meet all of  these different people like that's some amazing   like powerful source of information that we can  like use and alchemize and how many people are   listening to that and mindset's changing at the  same time that's that's the powerful thing about   this yeah yeah the thing that's like been strange  for me like when I started this I think the first   podcast had like 50 downloads and I'm like that's  not a massive number I'm like imagine 50 people   standing in your living room yeah listen to your  talk for like an hour and a half that's a trip   yeah so it's the power the power of this like  medium where we got big platform small platform   you are Rippling out and just being consistent  and that goes for anything just be consistent in   in your journey and trust that process and and  let that Ripple out to other people yeah and I   know this is a big question and sometimes we can't  answer these but what does like the next step of   your transition look like what is it you're going  to be trying to move in what do you think is the   next thing that you're gonna have to trust the  processing ah thank you for asking that because   I've been thinking about this over the last couple  of days actually when I now I think because of who   I am who I've accepted that I am um on this  journey of life it when I talk about work I   don't necessarily always mean like the job that  I'm doing I mean about what I'm actually working   through within myself within my insecurities  within my barriers like that's what the work is to   me yeah that's what's going to change my DNA and  if I ever have kids that's what they're gonna come   from that is such a powerful thing that I could  spend 10 hours talking to people need to realize   it or or maybe should look into not need to is  when we're changing we're changing our DNA and   you're changing your future children if you don't  already have children yeah and that's something   I'm super aware of you know those habits those  Cycles yeah if you can break them now you are   doing a service to the Future versions of you yeah  because well not you that you know the break off   from you yeah those little humans you're setting  them up for a better existence yeah I am so aware   of that you know it's like it's a big drive for me  so I'm like my work is working on integrating my   how do I say this my dark side my shadow side  because there's a thing that there's a stigma   as well with spirituality and with like positivity  with spirituality you have to be positive all the   time and that everything should be love and  light and yeah I realize in Ibiza one of the   Shadow sides of that is that there's so much  bypassing that goes on with that so much of   your like pain suffering time boundaries getting  crossed like so much of it gets swept under the   carpet and the mask with oh it's fine I'm  fine fine because you're worried about how   you're going to be perceived if you're not always  happy and so true you know and so it's like having   this strength of of my own character of knowing  like no I can be pissed off with this situation   with myself or with then show that to myself and  I can honor that within myself without hurting   anyone else I'm not going to tell myself that's  fine because it's not and I've realized like in   the last six months that I cannot ignore that  side of me anymore I think I sort of put on I   develop to people pleasing mentality that's part  of who I am I'm a nice person anyway I'm a kind   person but there were certain times where I would  say no to myself and yes to the world and now I'm   just like becoming very [Music] um disciplined  with that with like is this right for me am I   am I making this decision from a place from a good  place within myself am I afraid to say no to this   situation because of what that person might feel  or think so it's really like integrating what I   what I call is the darkness but it's just part  of life you know it's dark now it's going to be   light tomorrow it's like it's part of everything  that we're trying to say it's daytime all the   time that's where the Warriors are yeah exactly  something I've been really aware of like when I   I'm around certain people I'm like oh I can  tell they're a certain way we're gonna have   things in common if if people only talk about the  light it's always been an indicator to me that oh   this is maybe where you're at in a journey because  for me the darkness is where the growth happens no   you said about mushrooms coming up this time of  year yeah it's for a reason that they're in in   the darkness yeah but they've had to grow for them  to pop up yeah they've done all the growing in the   darkness yeah and when people don't talk about  that depth and those dark times and it is all   love and light for me I kind of just take a step  back from that because I'm like it's not where I   need to be when I hear people talk about no Shadow  side Shadow Self and you know exploring that how   to integrate that rather than deny it and think  it doesn't exist yeah that's really damaging yeah   of course it is come back up at some point yeah  because it's always there it's just whether you're   willing to accept it or not and look at it you  know it's always there that's what I've realized   it's like oh are these things just coming up now  no they're not they've always been there I've   always been just as light as I am dark I've always  had a lightness and a shadow side it's just that   now I'm brave enough to look there and to to bring  it in in a way that's not hurting anybody you know   yeah just to be more of a whole and complete and  authentic human being you know and to realize   nobody's always one way yeah we've got diff  we've got polarity we've got different sides of   ourselves so that's where I'm at in my spiritual  journey and I'm finding the balance because while   I'm working through this I've noticed that  some days I can be like a little bit more   [ __ ] than usual I'm just like I'm working it  out you know what I mean I'm like okay there's   a boundary but then I don't want to go too much  the other side so I'm in this space now where   I'm like rediscovering what my boundaries are  and rediscovering what my tone is going to be   going forward because it's quite a radical shift  going from people pleaser to like clear honest   integral person who says what they mean and means  what they say because it's true for them in that   moment it's quite a big shift it's a big layer  to pull back so I'm working on that internally   and externally I think I'm gonna move to London  actually yeah I feel like I want to be around   more things like this going on on a daily basis  so yeah I just feel like I want to move there   it's like trusting the process again I'm having  like I've had it on my vision board and on my   goals list for 10 years so I'm 30 soon so I feel  like it's a good time to to move that yeah yeah   I feel like that won't be your last stop as well I  feel like you're just somebody who's gonna explore   yeah multiple things and I'd say keep sharing and  documenting because it ripples out to people yeah   in ways you probably won't even realize yeah not  everyone will message you and say no thanks for   that yeah people really are consuming it and  I know what podcast I'm going to get loads of   information from you Michael Dawson start that  Journey but I wish you well in the next bit this   is obviously it's not like I'm saying goodbye for  the listeners yeah sure we're going to connect   again and hopefully you'll be back on again yeah  I want to keep you know the same people with the   same knowledge and further knowledge coming back  and revisiting and get listeners used to people   people who I value from what they put out into  the world yeah and has really moved together and   start creating something special and see what we  can do yeah completely whether you're in London   or here we'll make another podcast happen at  some point but I knew this is going to be great   yeah is that an hour and then you would go over  I know we could probably go for about four months   so we'll change it into a part two and we'll  have you back on another on another chat yeah   um where can people follow you if they want and  you know see your journey that you're on well   this has just inspiring me to put more things on  Instagram now so yeah just follow my Instagram   it's expressions of Jamie Luke I've changed my  handle recently because I want to make it more   about expressing myself through poetry through  videos as opposed to a wellness Journey so yeah   just follow me on Instagram and also I just want  to say thank you to you as well because like   you're inspiring me just being here and I'm like  observing how you can be going through something   in your life and alchemizing it and turning  it into something positive like and that's   just that's the magic of life like something  that's dark alchemizing and becoming something   beautiful that's going to help people so thank  you I appreciate it it's been a trip because I   started this off what I've gone through and  I'm not sure this with the listeners but at   the moment you know I had a really bad back not  being able to walk properly and this started from   right I need to get people to come to me to  start this podcast yeah because I can't go   anywhere yeah I can't move the equipment I  don't really want to shoot it from where I   live but if I'm gonna start this thing and start  the journey and Trust the process get it moving I   need to invite these people to me whilst I can't  physically go to them yeah and it is starting   something amazing so I'm I'm realizing that if  you can do stuff while going through the worst   time imagine what you can do when everything's  exactly flying and it is dying polarity like   you're always going to go through one thing or  the other but if you can make things happen in   the darkness the tough times jeez imagine yeah it  seem like the light's gonna look like so it isn't   sharing connecting with people like yourself  and you know you're taking time to come here   I'm just super grateful and these chats will  definitely resonate with other people as our   listeners grow we've already got listeners  that are tapping in and tapping in again so   as they get to know me they get to know other  people surrounding me and then yeah we'll just   grow this thing together yeah like a mushroom to  be continuous so thanks a lot for listening guys   um I know people like to listen to this in parts  so thank you if you stuck to the end if you want   to support the podcast it's not about money  but it does take a lot of time and effort and   dedication to do this if you want to show us  some support that way you can do and thanks   a lot for listening thanks a lot to Jamie  Lou we'll see you again remember no matter   what you go through life is good life is sound  we'll see you on the next one and stay blessed